I thought if and when DC re-introduced the Bronze Tiger back into comics it would be a weak watered down version of him, because they don't ever get him completely right; or it would be a reignited volcano of martial arts kick assery. However...I didn't see the full annihilation of the best African American character that they have / and he being burned in effigy. Why? I don't know, but I should have seen it coming. The over use of the tiger mask and the way most artist drew it to look like a real tiger head instead of a helmet or mask. The lack of exposure, inconsistent portrayals of Turner and his abilities and quite honestly not knowing what to do with a Black male character.
So the easy generic fix and blatant degradation of the character comes in the form of a catman. How could I not have seen it? What they've done is taken away everything that made him that one in ten thousand. They turned him into an animal, a full blown humanoid tiger. I've been contemplating whether or not to even cover this travesty.
Like the first Bronze Tiger comic book solo spotlight, that was so bad and spoke malice intention to the so called protagonist, this tigerman does worse.
I can hear Dutch laughing and the notorious racist / anti Semite HP Lovecraft might be getting ready to do the writing. Either way, DC has finally drove the message home (to me).
Being a man tiger has been done before.?. yeah in Batman the Brave and the Bold animated series and it was a damn good story. The episode was great, FOR A COMEDY. For a series that fused the campynesss of the sixties with the innovation and modernization of now, that always tended to get to silly.
From me it got a pass.
This new 52 tiger appears to be something totally different.
Is this a more serious take on the powers of the Wudang totem?
Is this even Ben Turner and he's on a quest to regain his humanity?
Or is this an epiphany of eugenics that's hiding behind a personal creative spin.?.
Whatever the case, tigerman the Thundercat shouldn't have been how the best martial artist in the DC nation was re-introduced to comics.
That's what I get for misplaced loyalties.
Was this take to much like right
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http://www.comicvine.com/articles/bronze-tiger-heading-to-the-new-52/1100-146500/
http://www.dccomics.com/blog/2013/05/03/what%E2%80%99s-new-in-the-new-52-%E2%80%93-bronze-tiger
http://forums.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?452626-What-s-New-in-the-New-52-Bronze-Tiger
i was thinking the whole Thundercat thing even before i got to that part of your posting. i'm in a bit of a rush right now but just so we're 100% clear. you know for sure that BT is going to be in the new DCU as humanoid cat?
ReplyDeleteI got this from DC comics.com, Comicvine,and a couple of other comic sites. I'll plug in the links.
DeleteThis catman is the new prototype for Bronze Tiger, that may appear in Red Hood and the outlaws.
Hey OA1,
DeleteI too agree that changing BT into a Man-cat or Catman would be an insult to the character! With him being one of the very few African-American male characters out there who have enough potential to be great, for DC to change him into some kind of humanoid would rob him of one of the most important parts of his identity, his race.
The first and most important reason for his character to have a revamp is to give him the exposure that he deserves, to showcase him and to increase his popularity. Not to change him into something new that would not represent him properly. Even if this version of him gains popularity and new fans, will they be a fan of the man or the animal. I believe that a bad-ass martial arts black man is better than a humanoid/hybrid/eugenic'ed up Cat-Man any day. DC comics just doesn't know what kind of jewel the Bronze Tiger is. Only an idiot who owns a diamond would throw it out the window. That is what DC would be doing if they follow through with this prototype.
They will never have loyal African American fans until they give them a character that they can identify with. Maybe they should rethink their strategy sometime, hell they keep remaking these Superman movies because obviously that is the only thing they think people want to see. I'm not looking forward to seeing this new man of steel movie; free ticket or not.
Can I just get a Bronze Tiger story that features the real Ben Turner, his martial arts and superpowers. I'm not even asking for a movie, just a story. OA1, I think maybe they should recruit you,so you can show them how to do it right.
Hey Lady it's been a minute since you've graced the Tiger cage with your presence. Thankx for the referral and the vote of confidence in my unequalled Bronze Tiger fan knowledge :)
DeleteReally though, If they go thru with this cat shit it's going to be the biggest act of disrespect to a Black character that I've seen in my years of comic reading. They have to see this is the wrong way to go. But like I said, without them understanding who the character is and the committed interest in propelling Ben Turner, this is the kind of crap we'll continue to get.
i spit on all things DC! almost makes me want to change my profile icon to that kid pissing on DC's new logo.
ReplyDeleteOnce again were all in together. I got to change some things up my friend. This move from DC is just wrong.
DeleteI saw this this morning, but the comment I wrote wouldn't publish (maybe Warners has shares in Google). Luckily Dave message reminded me. First off, that is a wickedly cool drawing of a tiger-man, but IT IS NOT BRONZE TIGER.
ReplyDeletePersonally I always thought the mask was the lamest aspect of an otherwise ultra cool character. When ever artists drew it, I was like he's not a were-tiger, or a dude who needs to put a tiger mask on to intimidate someone - he does that just by being the best there is at what he does, and you know you're in a world of hurt when his 'bring it on gaze' crosses yours.
To me this smells of marketing going "Muscleman in orange spandex just isn't an action figure we can sell by the caseloads. Can we give him claws, because it worked for that yellow guy at that other place." then realising a Tiger like the name would fly off Walmart shelves.
Luckily these guys dont have a similar shot at Black Panther, although I do now fear Catman will turn into a domestic British Blue with a penchant for a saucer of milk.
Damn shame right? Why not just create a new cat character (like they have done) and market that.?. Are those guys at DC that dumb or is it something they want stained and smudged?
DeleteDan thankx for coming over man and weighing in. I appreciate it, believe that.
back when Ben Turner was an assassin he was conditioned to associate the Tiger Mask with that side of his psyche that was the killer and filled with rage. so in essence when he put it on he became Bronze Tiger and went back to being Ben Turner when it wasn't on. as a member of the Suicide Squad he far more often then not didn't wear the Tiger Mask but i think he did sometimes as a reminder of his past. there's been a lot of different ways that the mask has been drawn over the years but to me it looked best in Checkmate (volume 2 ) #6 and #7. in general i liked the concept of the Tiger Mask and it's symbolism of the character.
ReplyDeleteSome people that didn't know Turner thought he was a meta human tiger. That goes to show how the neglect of the character had even before now taken away the essence of the Bronze Tiger.
DeleteEven my first encounter with BT, I thought he was another ass kicking white dude in a tiger mask; until he took off the batttle helmet. That sealed the deal for me. But for some people it was just the opposite because of the shitty drawings of the mask and the lack of attention that was shown to the character.
With that being said, it's still no excuse for DC to strip away the Tiger's ethnicity.
Okay. This is all in keeping with what seems to be the creedo of the New 52. Hey everybody, let's take that cool, ultra original character you've loved and looked up to from your childhood hoarding comics under your bed next to the candy bars, and turn it into something carbon copied and easy to sell to a mass market media. Never mind that the comics fan is (usually) smarter than that. Never mind that they're stripping out all basis for truly great storytelling, and personal growth. They just want to make a character that has punch. The claws of Wolverine. The Jawline of Superman. The darkness of The Batman. The bustline of Wonderwoman.
ReplyDeleteLet's entirely forget, for a moment, that these unique characters added depth to a universe populated with paragons no mortal could ever reach. They let us draw ourselves within the story, placing our psyche within theirs. Whether it was Bronze Tiger, Cyborg, The Teen Titans, Amanda Palmer, or countless others, it was the misfits that stood out to the young true believers. Sure, we loved Batman. But we couldn't ever see ourselves BEING Batman.
The sooner there is a change at DC the better. I really don't believe that any of them ever looked deeper than woman's measurements or the color of a man's skin to see if they were "cool" or not.
You might be right my friend, you might be right. Let me tell you about me. I try to give a man the benefit of the doubt. To see him as an equal not beneath me, to see his good, his intelligence etc.
DeleteSo I can't believe these professional intelligent guys writing and drawing entertainment media, don't realize the statements they make with their work.
But hey, I could be wrong.
Or, you know, they all have really huge Superman/Batman complexes.
Deletekekekeke.....this is tru
Deletehere's a podcast with ales kot and John Ostrander. it has it's interesting moments but it doesn't really contain the hard hitting questions i want to have asked and answered: http://popculturehound.net/episode-39-ales-kot-john-ostrander-talk-suicide-squad/
ReplyDeletei think at the end of the day the DC reboot is really not meant for the DC readers of the 70s and 80s. or at least not for those who were also continuous readers through the 90s and 2000s who also were fans of that old school stuff too. i think it's meant for brand new readers and for those who stopped reading the stuff in the last 20 years that might come back with a fresh start. but i can say for sure that DC is not for me anymore.
I really don't want to agree with you but they make it so damn hard. It's a lot of books I'm not going to support anymore that I was enjoying because now DC comics as a whole has fucking offended me with this bullshit. I might be jumping the gun, but with their track record, I don't think so.
DeleteIf I'm wrong, I'll be right back here formally praising what they do. But for this mockery of my very favorite African American DC character; no favorite African American comic book character period. Me and mine are finished with DC.
i don't think you're jumping the gun anymore then i did when i decided to drop the Suicide Squad after #10. here we are 10 issue later and i obviously am not regretting that decision especially when you consider all the other tie bullshit i would have wasted even more money on (Grifter appearance, Team 7, Zero issue).
Deleteanother good example why i hate the new Squad and the way DC has handled it is right here in this review yesterday that covers an Amanda Waller appearance in another DC title: http://tessatechaitea.blogspot.com/2013/05/justice-league-of-america-3.html
thanks for visiting the Rom blog as you can see things are a bit more updeat there even though i don't like Marvel much more then DC.
It seems that the Agent will be fighting Dire Wraiths with ROM from now on.
DeleteAnd Amanda isn't just cameo-ing in Justice League America, she's running the team. She's also connected to the Justice League. Amanda is all over the place. She's not bull shitting, I told you I been rolling with these bastards for a minute. I defected right after Doom War.
I kept some allegiances and ran recon but I was officially back in the Justice League. Dwayne McDuffie's League, Geoff John's corps, know what I'm saying? I was all in.
i'm looking forward to reading the Suicide Squad #20 review at tessatechaitea when it comes out.
DeleteMarvel made a similar mistake with T'Challa in the Avengers 2 animated movie. Still they show the Black Panther with the character regard of a Marvel hero.
ReplyDeletethe Bronze Tiger's backstory and resume is movie, investable gold. And DC can't even get a good comic book from the character. That speaks volume.
It's time for a new direction
http://www.indyplanet.com/store/product_info.php?products_id=8049
I'm too late to really take part in this discussion, but I'll throw in that stuff like this is actively deterring me from reading DC Comics. Of course, aside from some Justice League stuff I'm carrying for now, DC has spent the last decade destroying any love I had in my heart for it, and more importantly for them, any claim to the bills in my wallet.
ReplyDeleteThey finally got me Frank. Wounded but not killed. It's a lot of INDY comics that I'm now looking into. And it sort of got my muse going as well. So all in all they might have done the Kidd a favor.
DeleteWow. Well like Dan said, that tigerman drawomg is fucking awesome! But ths being the new BT? yeah, not so cool. I bet Omega shit a brick or two when he found out about this. People I keep telling tou, that's why I'm sticking with comics from Dynamite, Boom Studios, and other indies. They
ReplyDeletere not all carbon-copy characters, and there's actual story-telling done there.
Poor Omega. I'll do a hit for ya.
lol....What's up COMPADRE! Been a minute.
DeleteI didn't shit, I just said SHIT, These mutha fucka's done did the shit again.
Oh well, on to the indies.
OA1, same here. I gave up on Marvel long ago, and my DC money is now going to Image, Avatar, etc.
ReplyDeleteHey, pal. Did you read the recent issue of 'Red Hood and the Outlaws'? In it, there was a flashback sequence where Jay worked with a black assassin called Ben -- presumably Ben Turner -- and he doesn't look like Tony the Tiger.
ReplyDeleteFingers crossed that it stays that way.
I read about it but I havn't picked it up. I thought the dude was a tiger. When I saw the new design I stopped buying DC comics immediately. That's where I am with the big two right now.
DeleteSo I'm off to the comic book shop to see what's going on for myself. Thakx for stopping by, I needed this information.